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	<title>Comments on: Electroneutrality is dead?</title>
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	<link>http://www.chemistry-blog.com/2009/09/03/electroneutrality-is-dead/</link>
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		<title>By: Borek</title>
		<link>http://www.chemistry-blog.com/2009/09/03/electroneutrality-is-dead/comment-page-1/#comment-6625</link>
		<dc:creator>Borek</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Sep 2009 16:21:48 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I will repeat more or less what I have already posted on chemicalforums. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. They failed to address the simplest and the most likely explanations of observed phenomena:

1. Speration of pH - in the absence of convection/mixing H+/OH- transport is diffusion controlled. pH gradient during electrolysis seems to be the obvious effect of limited diffusion speed. Could be it is not - but it should be calculated to check.

2. Presence of the pH gradient implies they have concentration cell. Same problem as above - before explaining potential difference by &quot;charge separation&quot; they should prove observed results are not effects of concentration differences.

Extraordinary claims are there, but evidence has been left behind.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I will repeat more or less what I have already posted on chemicalforums. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. They failed to address the simplest and the most likely explanations of observed phenomena:</p>
<p>1. Speration of pH &#8211; in the absence of convection/mixing H+/OH- transport is diffusion controlled. pH gradient during electrolysis seems to be the obvious effect of limited diffusion speed. Could be it is not &#8211; but it should be calculated to check.</p>
<p>2. Presence of the pH gradient implies they have concentration cell. Same problem as above &#8211; before explaining potential difference by &#8220;charge separation&#8221; they should prove observed results are not effects of concentration differences.</p>
<p>Extraordinary claims are there, but evidence has been left behind.</p>
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		<title>By: mitch</title>
		<link>http://www.chemistry-blog.com/2009/09/03/electroneutrality-is-dead/comment-page-1/#comment-6624</link>
		<dc:creator>mitch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Sep 2009 15:48:29 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Thank you for the compliment. Agreed homeopathy is a stretch, but I see traces of it in their statement; I&#039;ve massaged my story accordingly.

Charge carrying structures doesn&#039;t freak you out? As a rule of thumb, like charges like to get as far away from each other as possible. So they wouldn&#039;t be taking a pony-express ride on the water structure highway they would likely be on the sides of the beaker. 

The controls are not as stringent as you may imagine. The capture of CO2 into the solution is a ubiquitous problem in good electrochemistry measurements. Thus as the CO2 dissociates in water to H+ + HCO3- you now have an electrolyte. As the authors didn&#039;t mention taking this precaution, the whole control is suspect.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you for the compliment. Agreed homeopathy is a stretch, but I see traces of it in their statement; I&#8217;ve massaged my story accordingly.</p>
<p>Charge carrying structures doesn&#8217;t freak you out? As a rule of thumb, like charges like to get as far away from each other as possible. So they wouldn&#8217;t be taking a pony-express ride on the water structure highway they would likely be on the sides of the beaker. </p>
<p>The controls are not as stringent as you may imagine. The capture of CO2 into the solution is a ubiquitous problem in good electrochemistry measurements. Thus as the CO2 dissociates in water to H+ + HCO3- you now have an electrolyte. As the authors didn&#8217;t mention taking this precaution, the whole control is suspect.</p>
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		<title>By: Joel</title>
		<link>http://www.chemistry-blog.com/2009/09/03/electroneutrality-is-dead/comment-page-1/#comment-6623</link>
		<dc:creator>Joel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Sep 2009 15:21:09 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>A well written article, but I think the stretch to homeopathy is harder than the stretch from O&amp;P in suggesting a macrostructure. Thixotrophy has been observed in pure water, as cited, and no suggestion is made that &quot;all solutions have their own structure&quot; or anything as homeopathetic as that.

C&amp;C offered a conventional explanation which does not seem to take account of the controls (no salt, no indicator) performed by O&amp;P. I find the reply by the original authors presents quite a good argument.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A well written article, but I think the stretch to homeopathy is harder than the stretch from O&amp;P in suggesting a macrostructure. Thixotrophy has been observed in pure water, as cited, and no suggestion is made that &#8220;all solutions have their own structure&#8221; or anything as homeopathetic as that.</p>
<p>C&amp;C offered a conventional explanation which does not seem to take account of the controls (no salt, no indicator) performed by O&amp;P. I find the reply by the original authors presents quite a good argument.</p>
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